AI-Era Law Firm Marketing: Build Real Authority (Full Transcript)

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Zach, and this is episode 603 of the Lawyer's Podcast, part of the Legal Talk Network. Today I talk with Karin Conroy of Conroy Creative Council about law firm marketing in the age of AI. Specifically, though, we're talking about how now more than ever it is important to show your authority to the world, your authority, your expertise, and how to build your brand in a way that, you know, doesn't rely on AI slop. Anyway, we'll get into that here in a second, and yeah, here's my conversation with Karin.

[00:00:54] Speaker 2: Hi, I'm Karin Conroy, and I am the founder and creative director of Conroy Creative Council. We do law firm marketing.

[00:01:03] Speaker 1: Hi, Karin. Hi, Zach. Thank you for being with me again. You've been on the podcast multiple times. I think we've gone through kind of your pedigree a couple times, so I don't want to go through too much, but you've been connected with us at Lawyerist for a while now, and you've been doing what you do, which is help law firms with their marketing for a while now as well. Yeah. And I think in some of our previous conversations, we've talked about you seeing iterations of, you know, kind of like the internet coming up and us being around in this space for us going to the cloud and things like that, and lately, ta-da, you and I have been talking about AI. Of course. Yeah.

[00:01:43] Speaker 3: That's what gets the clicks.

[00:01:44] Speaker 1: That's what gets the clicks. That's exactly right. But it's also, I mean, it gets the clicks because it's on people's minds, right?

[00:01:51] Speaker 2: That's true. That's true. Yeah. They go hand in hand.

[00:01:53] Speaker 1: It is, yeah. It is on my mind because recently, and I mean recently, recently, in the last couple days, some of these artificial intelligence companies, the LLM style companies like Claude and ChatGPT have released this ability, these agentic abilities. And I guess they've released these agentic abilities before, but like they're starting to, we're starting to get into a land of like, oh my God, this thing can actually do stuff for me.

[00:02:24] Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:02:26] Speaker 1: And that has gotten me thinking about how we are interacting with the creation of content and even the consumption of content in a fundamentally different way, even over the last couple of weeks.

[00:02:42] Speaker 2: Yeah. I think it's super interesting to look at the progression of this, but then to also put it in the context of previous technological advances. And obviously there's differences and variations and this is going at an exponential rate. But what I really encourage people to keep doing in terms of marketing, like this is obviously so much bigger than marketing, but we've got 20 minutes and so we're not going to get into the whole scope of the world.

[00:03:10] Speaker 1: We're not going to solve AI right here.

[00:03:13] Speaker 2: Yeah, no, we're going to just do a little sliver. But in terms of marketing is how does this fit and where do these core concepts still apply and where can we kind of take a breath and take a step back and say, okay, what's a realistic way for me to use this in a way that's actually going to help? But also there is a very quick kind of avenue to it eroding your trust. And so there's a lot of articles I've been reading lately about this concept of trust erosion and that this is a thing that we're going to be keep continuing to see. Trust erosion where we all now are very wary of em dashes, for example. And I love the em dash. I love it. But it has got a bad branding moment right now for em dash.

[00:04:03] Speaker 1: It does. It does. Em dash needs a marketing team.

[00:04:06] Speaker 2: Seriously. Yeah. It needs to. I don't know. I feel like it's a little too late because even now when I'm using the em dash, I go back in and throw in a comma. Even though it totally changes the feel of it.

[00:04:21] Speaker 1: Right? Yeah. It does. It does.

[00:04:23] Speaker 2: But now the em dash is saying something else. The em dash is alluding to, I didn't write this. And whether you did or not, or whether you used some AI and that's the first thing you're going to go and look like, hey, did you, even though I told you not to put the em dashes in there, did you do that? And so I need to go and double check for these indicators that are going to erode the trust. And now there's a whole other message coming with whatever this message is I'm putting together. There's this, Oh, you couldn't bother to type out an email. You had to use chat GPT, which I do all the time, but I'm going to make sure there's no em dashes. So there's these, all these different things happening at the same time. And we need to, as marketers pay attention to the things that are going to erode that trust like an em dash. So we need to use it, but then pay attention at the same time and like find that fine tuning line where it's still working for you, but working for you, not against you.

[00:05:26] Speaker 1: One of the things that I've, I've read and, and, um, watched, uh, recently is this idea that, okay, the em dash is a, at least right now, pretty good tell, but the, the lack of depth to the writing, the, the, that is the bigger tell that it was done by AI is it doesn't say anything really, you know, it doesn't have any depth. It doesn't have any, it's not, it's not adding to the conversation. And that's really, that's not what AI, you know, the LLMs are for. They're not there to really add to the conversation.

[00:06:07] Speaker 2: No, no, they're there to just summarize in a, yeah. Right. To gather and summarize and kind of regurgitate.

[00:06:14] Speaker 1: Right. And so I think of our interaction as lawyers, um, especially in the, the marketing space is kind of being, having two issues right now. One is that a, I can create a ton of content.

[00:06:28] Speaker 2: Yeah.

[00:06:29] Speaker 1: You know, I can create a ton of content. And so like, there's no more like, uh, I have to create, I have to write a blog page today or this week I have to write one page. Yeah. It's like, no, you can do that in 13 seconds. And then the other side is how people are finding us, because personally I haven't touched Google in a month.

[00:06:51] Speaker 4: Yeah.

[00:06:52] Speaker 1: That's not how I find things. I, I go and I work with chat, GBT or Claude or something like that. So how is this affecting those things and, and how attorneys deal with that?

[00:07:04] Speaker 2: Yeah, I think there's a lot there because, um, there is this idea that we had to constantly put out this, this steady stream of, of content in order to just stay alive on Google and Google doesn't want that anymore because it's not even Google we're talking to. We're talking to these LLMs who are making a judgment on what they find on Google being whatever else. So it's a different conversation. And I've seen a lot of different conversations about this where it's, Oh, not much has changed. You really just need to keep kind of doing the thing that you're doing and putting out the content all the way to stop everything that, you know, like there's so much, uh, news out there about how to think about all of this. Um, it's, you know, you and I were saying, this is like, it's like drinking from a fire hose at a constant and it changes every single day. Here's what I, what I know. And here's how I'm trying to frame it in my own head is there is this thing on Google called a knowledge panel. Are you familiar with this? I can't remember if we talked about this in previous episodes.

[00:08:14] Speaker 1: We've talked about it before. Yeah. And I've, I've still failed to, to go kind of like look into my own, but you have, you come up in the knowledge panel for your own search, right?

[00:08:22] Speaker 2: Right. Because I've done the work. It does take a little bit of effort. And by a little bit, I mean, you know, a few hours, probably you Google like either your name or your brand more, more likely your name. And if you Google my name, um, you'll see that the result is not just a standard search result. It used to be about a third of the top of the Google search results. Now it's close to the whole page and it's basically what Google is finding about you. And in order to make this happen, I had to, first of all, have my name out there on multiple different platforms and be kind of a known thing within Google. And then when I, there was a day when I Googled my name and the, and there was a knowledge panel there and then it gave me an option to claim it. And so then I had to go through this whole process where I like held my license up to the screen and did a video, like it was a whole thing, which is good because it's sort of like getting that blue check mark on social media, right? Like you're validated, you're, you're verified. And, and I did that probably at least a couple of years ago. Uh, and now it's become this big thing. And the reason I keep coming back to this is because this is a visual example of what the LLMs are looking for. So this is what the LLMs are pulling from and what they think of you. And Google is just, this knowledge panel is showing you like, Hey, this is what we think of you. This is what we found from all over all of our sources on the internet. So you'll see there's like my Twitter feed, my, you know, my appearances on lawyers. And it's usually what it wants to see is what everybody else is saying about you. That is, it finds that to be more true. And so these LLMs also will find what everyone else is saying about you to be more true than this garbage that you may be churning about yourself on your own about page. Because obviously anybody's going to say anything like I went to Harvard and I, you know, like you, but if someone else, if Harvard is saying, I went to Harvard. Okay. Yeah. That's probably true then.

[00:10:24] Speaker 1: Yeah. I think that's, that's the thing is like, uh, how does, how does an LLM detect lying, you know?

[00:10:32] Speaker 4: Right.

[00:10:32] Speaker 1: And, and so if I see somebody like, I literally don't know how I detect a lie, you know, but like we, we all think like, well, I can probably sniff out a lot of BS, but how does an LLM detect lying? Well, if you're saying it about yourself, it likely has more potential to be a lie or an exaggeration. But if somebody else is saying it about you and there's a lot of people saying about you, then it might have more potential to be, to be true. And so, okay. So if I want to be the best PI attorney, the best car crash attorney in Memphis, Tennessee, I can't just go out there and be like, I'm the best car crash attorney in Memphis.

[00:11:09] Speaker 2: Well, here's the thing this you could 20 years ago, or let's see, let's, let's, let me think of when the kind of garbage SEO era was. I'd say like, uh, you know, oh, five to 2010 ish was when people were doing a lot of keyword stuffing and just garbage. And, and it worked like, let's just be honest. They were doing it because it worked. Right. So if you wanted to say, let's say that you weren't even finished with law school. Let's say that you weren't even technically a lawyer yet, but you wanted to throw up a website and say, I'm the best PI attorney in Memphis. I've done 500 car accident, you know, uh, cases and blah, blah. You want to say whatever you want to say. Google's like, okay. You know, it's sort of like this bumbling sort of dumb, um, bot. It is not a bumbling, dumb bot anymore. And then these LLMs is, are the offshoot sort of children of an even smarter bot. So they are, you know, many, many, many times smarter than the smartest version of Google. And they're going to say, wait a minute, you are saying that you are a PI attorney. I think you are 19. I think you are in law school because I just found your law school page on, you know, and your law school is saying that you are still an active student. This is what the rest of the internet is saying about you. Right. No, we are not going to give you as that result. And so the, those LLMs are going basically going to, uh, be more complex in their results based on a lot of other sources.

[00:12:52] Speaker 1: So now I've got to go instead of, of being able to just kind of have my website, keyword stuff, say I'm the, you know, scream it from the rooftops from one spot. Now I've got to go create that authority somehow. Right.

[00:13:05] Speaker 2: Exactly. Yeah. So now you, you need to have other people talking about you. And once again, without being overwhelmed by all of this AI stuff, let's just talk about what that meant 30 years ago before the internet. And, um, you know, that was what we marketers were talking about in like textbooks that were actual, like physical $120 textbooks.

[00:13:29] Speaker 1: What's that?

[00:13:31] Speaker 2: There's going to be a day. I wonder if my kids are going to have textbooks in college, but I doubt it, but I did.

[00:13:39] Speaker 1: I was thinking about encyclopedias the other day and how we used to do research and, and write exactly.

[00:13:46] Speaker 2: And you're like going through the a, a, a, a, a, b, a, a, yeah. So there is a filing system in our brain that works that way. And so if you go back to these textbooks and these ideas of like, what does it mean? First of all, why are we marketing and what are we trying to do? And what are these bigger goals? It is this credibility and authority, especially when it comes to law firms. Like, you know, if we're talking about a product and you know, all that, that's a little different, but when it comes to law firms, trust, authority, credibility, let's build all that stuff up so that when something happens to a person that they need your type of services, you're the top of mind, right? These are classic marketing words, top of mind, authority, credibility, like building, you know, like, you know, price, product, and promotion, like all of this stuff. These are chapters in that textbook, right?

[00:14:37] Speaker 1: There's the same, same stuff that they were doing in Mad Men.

[00:14:40] Speaker 2: Exactly. Yeah. Oh my gosh, we could have a whole Mad Men show.

[00:14:44] Speaker 1: Oh, we should, we should. That would be so good. Vote in the comments below if we should have a Mad Men show.

[00:14:50] Speaker 2: Oh my, that would be so good. Okay, I just had a moment where my brain spiraled off on me.

[00:14:58] Speaker 1: Okay, but what we're talking about though, the reason that that is interesting is because like the basics that we've been doing in, you know, big M marketing.

[00:15:09] Speaker 3: Yes.

[00:15:09] Speaker 1: Are what we're talking about again, it's... Right. I think of sometimes Simrush and Google Analytics telling us like, well, you got 150,000 page views. And it's like, and we've had these vanity numbers and these vanity things. And we've thought we were counting stuff.

[00:15:28] Speaker 4: Right.

[00:15:28] Speaker 1: For so many years.

[00:15:29] Speaker 4: Yeah.

[00:15:30] Speaker 1: And it led us away from this. Now we're, I feel like now we're kind of like stripping back that veil of like, of what we thought was control and saying, go be a damn expert.

[00:15:41] Speaker 2: Right. Yeah. It's a bunch of garbage. Like picture the Wizard of Oz and the curtain is just like a curtain of garbage. It's kind of smelly.

[00:15:54] Speaker 1: It doesn't matter what my SEO is if I'm crap or...

[00:16:00] Speaker 2: If you have no business, if nobody's calling.

[00:16:02] Speaker 1: Everybody comes to my website and it's like, nah, I don't like him.

[00:16:05] Speaker 2: I don't think so. Yeah.

[00:16:06] Speaker 1: He does not seem like a...

[00:16:08] Speaker 2: He's not my guy.

[00:16:09] Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't matter.

[00:16:11] Speaker 2: He does not look like he could do my thing.

[00:16:13] Speaker 1: Well, and so now it's like, well, I get to kind of like jump over that. There's SEO, there's AEO, like we still need to be doing those things, but I can kind of jump over that and say, let me just be an authority.

[00:16:25] Speaker 2: Well, exactly. You get to jump over that and get through that curtain. If you truly are an expert and an authority.

[00:16:33] Speaker 1: Oh God, I can hear people's... I can hear people, oh, but I'm not the best PI attorney in Memphis.

[00:16:40] Speaker 2: Yeah, right. So I don't have advice for people who are trying to actively lie.

[00:16:46] Speaker 1: I don't know how to do it if you actually are crap at your job, but if you're not crap at your job...

[00:16:50] Speaker 2: Sorry about that one. I don't have that answer for that. I've been doing this a long time, but that one is not in my like wheelhouse.

[00:17:00] Speaker 1: Okay, so let's go to the people that do have authority and they just need to show it. Exactly. How do we do that? Because people have gotten away from that now, I think.

[00:17:08] Speaker 2: Well, exactly. And that's what I think is the good news here, is that with all of the algorithms and the technical stuff and all of this agentic AI and all of the words, at the end of the day, what I want people to take away is that this is good news for people who truly are experts and authorities because the AI is wading through all the garbage, wading through all that keyword stuffing, and they're finding the people who are the authorities and the authorities based on what other people are saying. If you are that authority and you are out there on podcasts, on media appearances, and you've got links on other websites, and you've been doing all of those things and they're pulling back to your website, let's also just drop that your website is not going to be your first impression anymore.

[00:17:54] Speaker 1: But you still have to have it.

[00:17:56] Speaker 2: You have to have it as the hub, but it's not your first impression. It's not the front door. Nope. The front door is probably some LLM or somebody else's site. Let's say you have a CNN media appearance. Somebody saw you on CNN. That's the first impression. And then they come to your website, and now you have to support that and do all the things that you recognize that that's the second step.

[00:18:17] Speaker 1: Right.

[00:18:18] Speaker 2: So if you are able to, if you have the authority, if you're looking to build that authority, if you have the credibility, the things to say, and you get out there, you put it out there, then you're going to be found, and it's going to be a piece of cake. And this AI stuff is good news for you because you're going to rise to the top because of that.

[00:18:38] Speaker 1: So you're telling me that us doing this show increases your authority?

[00:18:45] Speaker 2: 100%. If you look at my knowledge panel, these lawyerist episodes that I have done are almost always, there's at least one, sometimes two or more right there on that front page of my knowledge panel, because lawyerist is saying, she knows what she's talking about.

[00:19:04] Speaker 1: Right. I just wanted to put it to a real thing. Exactly. Because that's what you're talking about. You've got a thing on your website, conroycreativecouncil.com slash authority hyphen tour. Talk to me about this authority tour, because what I'm assuming you're saying is, I can show you how some of this is done, at the very least.

[00:19:27] Speaker 2: Exactly. Well, I can show you, and we can also do it for you. So it's a good amount of work.

[00:19:32] Speaker 1: Yeah. I like that because lawyers are, I don't know, trying to practice law. Busy.

[00:19:37] Speaker 2: You should be busy. And so we will put it all together for you, because it's a lot of work. You need to show up, and there's a combination of some PR stuff. That is a ton of work. That's a whole project just there, just doing the follow-up and the seeking out the right places, finding them, doing all of that stuff. So we find all the podcast appearances. We find any potential media appearances. We get you on those. We do a whole media kit. We do all of that PR-related stuff for that. And then we promote it in various ways. And we make sure that we get all of the clout and the credibility for each of those appearances. And we build the equivalent of your knowledge panel for you in order for you to kind of do your lawyer work, but also be considering this authority and how you're going to grow in that way.

[00:20:28] Speaker 1: A lot of times when I think about law and law practice, I think of my father. And I feel like my father wouldn't necessarily think, oh, I have enough authority to do that. You know, the idea of a lawyer, a solo lawyer, having a media kit, it's wonderful. And I think it's appropriate. So my question really is, who is this for? And I want to encourage people, it's for you. Who is this for?

[00:21:00] Speaker 2: Yeah. You know, first of all, I think your father was probably in a different generation. And the up-and-coming lawyers have no problem being online. No problem. And in a lot of cases with their egos.

[00:21:12] Speaker 1: But they don't have a media kit.

[00:21:14] Speaker 2: They don't have a media kit. Let me just talk about what a media kit typically is. It's a bunch of information that these podcasts, media places are going to need to know about you. That's very slick, well-designed, talks about you, has your headshot, talking points, all of that stuff. That's just put together so that when you are going on an appearance, they have everything they need. And they don't have to say, okay, what do you want to talk about? You know, so that's a media kit. But it's very well done. And it's positioned in a way that works for you also, you and your firm. So if you and your firm are trying to grow in a certain angle, like, hey, we really want to build our car accident type of cases because we just got out of law school and we were telling everybody that we're the best. We got to kind of prove it.

[00:22:01] Speaker 1: Not got to be that. Whoops. Okay, so the niche is still there.

[00:22:09] Speaker 2: Right. It should be. Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, the idea of niching. Exactly. It's kind of, okay, this is what they're really good at and what they want to talk about and all that stuff. But who this is for, it could be a combination of people who are at that, like, we're just starting a new firm. But more often than not, it's a lot of partners who know that they need to be out there. They know they need to be networking. And they may be doing some of that and they may be showing up at some other stuff, but they really want to magnify that and multiply it and get the network and borrow the audience that already exists on these other podcasts.

[00:22:48] Speaker 1: Sorry, my brain just went to when I talk to a lot of our labsters about doing their marketing, you know, and I say, like, how do you get your clients? And a lot of people, you know, they say referrals.

[00:23:01] Speaker 2: Yeah.

[00:23:02] Speaker 1: It seems like this would be phenomenal.

[00:23:05] Speaker 2: Right.

[00:23:05] Speaker 1: For people, even to get referrals, you know. Well, that's the other piece.

[00:23:11] Speaker 2: I mean, you know that I've done a lot of podcasts. I have people on my podcast. And it is not just the simple math of how many people download that podcast. It is you and I sat and chatted for a long time before we started recording. You know, the kind of work I do. I know the kind of work you do. I am going to send things your way and say and vice versa, because we have a connection and every interaction is that way. So you're making a connection with a whole audience and a person who is at the kind of head of that audience. And that person has the potential to send you a whole bunch of leads as opposed to just one lead at a time as, you know, one listener at a time. So there's a bunch of networking stuff happening there.

[00:23:56] Speaker 1: Well, and even if I get my even if I get my referrals from, you know, going to local stuff, yeah, I'm going to, you know, I'm part of the Lions Club or something like that. Like, right. Having these sorts of media kit things.

[00:24:12] Speaker 4: Yeah.

[00:24:12] Speaker 1: Make me look slick. Make me look sharp, you know.

[00:24:17] Speaker 2: And they make you look like you're the authority figure on this topic. Right. So and here's the thing. You and I have talked about this whole referral idea. I've talked about this ad nauseam. But saying that referrals are how you get your marketing is not a marketing strategy. It's bad. You're still marketing. And so to say like I get this in the phone calls all the time to say, oh, I don't really do marketing. It's all about referrals. Well, you are doing marketing because somehow someone's calling you, but it's just badly done. So you need to tie this in and you need to think in terms of, OK, how can I systematize my referrals? How can I make this systematic? How can I take these people? And every time I get a referral, I already know, OK, I'm going to do the following 12 things. I'm going to add this person to an email list. I'm going to add the referral source to a thank you list. I'm going to send them this gift. I'm going to do the following things. And you've spent time a year ago thinking about what that is so that when it happens, you check a box and someone else just runs with it.

[00:25:18] Speaker 1: Yeah.

[00:25:19] Speaker 2: Yeah. So that's a whole other thing. But becoming an authority on this topic is the same idea. So that when you get these referrals, then all of a sudden you have a system and you've got this all in place. And you've also got the system that is constantly building that authority and building maybe referral sources through those podcast connections and kind of building that marketing system so that there's these kind of three levels of marketing. You're building, stabilizing, and growing, right? So in this building part, you're constantly churning and there's something happening. And you're not just abandoning building once you get to stabilize. You're still building while you're also stabilizing. And then once you kind of build these ideas and you're doing these podcasts and you're showing up however you're showing up, then you start to stabilize. You get those numbers and you start to figure out what's working and where the good leads are coming from and which podcasts am I going to continue to do and which ones were a total waste, taking all that data. And then you're growing and you're figuring out, okay, how do we really scale this? How do we take it to the level that I've dreamt of? And you're not trying to scale when you're in that build phase. You're building in the build phase.

[00:26:39] Speaker 1: It's what's called build phase. It's not called scale phase. Yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense to me. Even to me, that makes sense, Karin.

[00:26:48] Speaker 2: Right, exactly. But that's where people get frustrated is they expect to start in the growth phase and you haven't done the building. So know where you're at and be realistic about it. And don't think that the build phase is the shortcut phase. It's not the shortcut cheater phase. We're going to build something really solid, really good, good strategy, good messaging, all of that good stuff so that when we get to the next levels, it's not garbage.

[00:27:19] Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, Karin, one of the things you and I've talked to a couple times over the last year or so, and I use the word couple to mean like three or four, which apparently is weird to other people.

[00:27:32] Speaker 3: That's a weird couple.

[00:27:33] Speaker 1: Yeah, but you and I have talked a few times. And one of the things that strikes me every time we talk, especially in this world of AI advancements, is that we're not changing the mantra here.

[00:27:48] Speaker 2: Yes, yeah.

[00:27:50] Speaker 1: You're not saying, oh, you need to go do this because it's the new fad. You need to go do this. You and I haven't even touched the actual word AEO.

[00:27:59] Speaker 2: Right.

[00:27:59] Speaker 1: Yeah, we need to be thinking about that. But what I really like about your mentality on these things and your advice here is that it hasn't changed over the long haul here while everything else has. And it's still correct. So I like that. It's the build and gain authority. And we kind of got to get back to basics here, y'all. Right.

[00:28:24] Speaker 2: But it's good news because things have changed. Like, let's also be realistic. There is a lot going on with AI, and it is changing things. But for those people who have the authority and the credibility, that's what AI is looking for. And so that's good for you. If you are trying to do the shortcuts and you are thinking that you're going to build an entire automated law firm with bots, I have bad news for you. It's not so good.

[00:28:52] Speaker 1: Oh, man.

[00:28:53] Speaker 2: But if you've got this expertise, you've got things to talk about, you know what you're talking about, and people know that, then we just need to expand on that and let AI know about that. And then that's going to be good because all that garbage is going to go away. That's the thing people are freaking out about is that the garbage is going away. And it's like, okay, I'm okay with the garbage going away because I'm not garbage. Exactly. That was like harmonious.

[00:29:21] Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly right. That's something you said earlier before we started recording was that, again, getting into how easy it is to make content. And if you try to do the shortcuts of being like, well, I'm just going to create a crap ton of blogs, that's garbage content. And the AI now is where these bots are sifting through that and sending it away.

[00:29:45] Speaker 2: And to be fair, everybody's promoting this like, oh, my gosh, a website in 14 minutes. And so it's hard to find that balance. And I'm seeing all this stuff. And I've tried a million different things because I have to say, oh, okay, that's a really good sales pitch. Let me see. And then I go in and it's like, okay, that's garbage. So it's hard to find that place of where the garbage is and trying things out. And we've all seen the too many em dashes because that's become a thing. But when AI first started, everybody's using the em dashes and nobody really realized it until they saw like 700 of them. They're like, wait a minute, what is with the em dashes? So to be fair, there is a good place for AI. And it's about finding that balance and using it efficiently without losing your soul and losing the core of that authority that you bring to the table and making sure that that stays healthy and valid and in the forefront.

[00:30:46] Speaker 1: To the listeners, if you want to stop being garbage, you need to go to conroycreativecouncil.com slash authority hyphen tour. No, but really, the listeners out there have authority. They are experts. They know what they're doing. We are lawyers. We know how to practice these things. And if you want to start thinking about how do I need to position myself in a way that I can get seen and I will attract clients, that seems to be what this conroycreativecouncil.com slash authority hyphen tour is.

[00:31:25] Speaker 2: Right. Authority hyphen tour, not em dash.

[00:31:28] Speaker 1: Not em dash. And it is the hyphen, not the n dash either, if you want to get super nerdy with everybody.

[00:31:36] Speaker 2: I have like 3,000 fonts on my computer. We could talk fonts and glyphs and all of that stuff.

[00:31:43] Speaker 1: That's a whole other show. We will. I have plenty of typeface and typesetting. I come from a long line of typesetters.

[00:31:53] Speaker 3: I love it. And the Gutenberg press. Oh, my goodness. Is that in your family history?

[00:31:59] Speaker 1: Not that. We go back to some other presses that my, yeah, the line of type machine, my grandfather had worked on various things and my uncle had worked on various things and not anything like impressive, but just like, we will do some. So.

[00:32:16] Speaker 2: So he would love this em dash conversation.

[00:32:18] Speaker 1: He would absolutely love it.

[00:32:20] Speaker 2: He'd be all in.

[00:32:21] Speaker 1: Yes. Or hate it. I don't know. But he'd have an opinion.

[00:32:25] Speaker 2: Exactly. Yeah. I think that the goal is to find the way for the AI bots to find you so that you're showing up in this, a similar idea as to the knowledge panel, whether you have a knowledge panel or not use that as the visual in your brain. So that is like just authority. This is where we found this person all over the internet. This is all the things we know to be true about this person. And then, and then draw the line. Don't, don't go too far with the AI where all of a sudden now it's going to erode all that.

[00:33:00] Speaker 1: Awesome. Well, Karin, once again, thank you for, for being on the show and, and bringing your, your authority and your knowledge to, to all of our listeners. And I'm, I'm going to say it again because you got to, uh, if people want to learn more, they can go to Conroy creative council. That's seize on all of that.com slash authority hyphen tour. And, uh, yeah. Book your authority tour.

[00:33:24] Speaker 3: That's it. Thank you.

[00:33:26] Speaker 1: Awesome. Thanks, Karin. We'll see you.