Speaker 1: I'm curious to know if any of you are aware as to whether or not the FBI is involved at all In determining what's going on in Springfield, Ohio because as far as I'm concerned there is domestic terrorism afoot and it is at the The word of the Republican nominee and his running mate So do we know if anyone is checking into that on the federal level? I'm just curious just say yes or no anybody I don't know. Okay, perfect Either way, I want to move on and I want to talk about Mr. Kirshner, I'm just curious if you were to define what weaponization of the federal government looks like just in a quick short definition, what would it be?

Speaker 2: using the Department of Justice to reward your friends and your criminal associates by delivering pardons after they've been Convicted by juries or before their case was even concluded or before their case was even charged and Conversely using the Department of Justice to punish your perceived enemies order investigations and prosecutions Even if they're not warranted by evidence, I'm sorry, that was not brief. That's okay

Speaker 1: It was accurate because that's how I see weaponization as well And it's something that we saw a lot out of Trump specifically because all of his friends were going to prison and he's probably got more friends that are headed to prison soon And if we are lucky, he will find him a cellmate soon as well But nevertheless as we talk about weaponization because this whole committee feels as if it's projection I want to go to something That's pretty interesting, but I'm gonna start with mr. Allen I wasn't on this committee the first time you were here. So this is the first time we're interacting But I am caught up to speed and I have a simple question for you. Yes or no Do you believe that career employees like yourself should have your job taken away? Even if you've done your job well and followed agency rules Do you think it's right to be fired just because you have political disagreements with those above you?

Speaker 3: No, it's not right to persecute anyone for their political or religious beliefs, especially in an organization where they're supposed to be the free flow of

Speaker 1: Ideas, okay. I appreciate your answer and your honesty and I absolutely agree with you It is interesting though, because that's exactly what Trump and my Republican colleagues would do if they won the election It's spelled out in project 2025 Trump would strip due process rights available to career civil servants and remove suspend or reduce their pay in an all-out effort to oust Agency employees for partisan reasons rather than because of issues with merit or performance and before you say Trump and project 2025 aren't affiliated I'd ask unanimous consent to submit into the record Trump's campaign page where he claims on day one. I'd reissue 2020 executive order restoring the president's authority to fire rogue bureaucrats and I will wield that power very aggressively The only reason democracy is standing strong today is because we had public servants who pledged loyalty To the Constitution and rule of law and not to Donald Trump. Mr. Kirshner your testimony today demonstrates You're familiar with project 2025. Is that a fair statement?

Speaker 2: As It pertains to the Department of Justice. Okay, and you are aware or maybe you're not

Speaker 1: We'll see on page 547 that project 2025 states its goal of implementing a top-to-bottom overhaul of DOJ that quote must include the FBI because anything less would quote Guarantee the failure of the conservative administration's agenda

Speaker 2: That does not make a lot of sense to me, okay, but that that's in project 2025 it is on yes it is

Speaker 1: All right. Just wanted to clarify that And also this agenda includes for example enforcing federal criminal laws against providers and distributors of abortion medication as well as rescinding policies that hold that sex discrimination includes discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation Transgender identity among other things. Is that correct? Yes representative on page 562

Speaker 2: They talk about aggressively going after prosecuting quote providers and distributors of abortion pills that use the mail So folks who are you know mailing abortion pills to women who need it? That is really not what is endangering our country or inspiring, you know violent crime. I absolutely agree

Speaker 1: This week the New York Times reported multiple instances of Trump trying to weaponize the DOJ to retaliate against his political enemies Finding the quote. Mr. Trump told mr. McGahn that he wanted to order. Mr. Sessions the Attorney General to prosecute Mrs. Clinton and mr. Comey and if mr. Sessions refused he would take matters into his own hands. I Know my time is running out. So I just have to ask mr. Chairman given you've convened this hearing Theoretically, it's you Given that you've convened this hearing on weaponizing federal agencies Will you commit to publicly condemning Trump for attempting to weaponize the government and condemn project? 2025 for its efforts to do the same

Speaker 2: Gentlelady's time has expired