IS Camp Escapes Raise Alarm Amid Syria-Kurd Deal (Full Transcript)

[00:00:00] Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Celia Hatton, and welcome to the BBC's Global News Podcast on YouTube, where we go behind the headlines to focus on one story and why it matters. Today, we're looking at what's happening to the prison camps holding Islamic State suspects and their families after a series of high-profile escapes. Those camps are in Syria, and the Syrian government's just reached a ceasefire deal that will see Kurdish forces gradually integrate with the Syrian army. It's hoped this will end weeks of fighting in the northeast. Stability in that part of Syria is really important to people in many countries because that's where the camps are located, and they're guarded by the Kurds. We're joined by the BBC's Middle East correspondent, Lina Sinjab, who's just returned from Syria. Lina, hi.

[00:00:50] Speaker 2: Pleasure. Thanks for having me.

[00:00:53] Speaker 1: Okay, so can we start by talking about these camps, these Islamic State fighter camps? I mean, tell us how big are they and who is being held inside them?

[00:01:04] Speaker 2: Well, there are several locations, several prisons, if we can call them, but the biggest one is Al-Hawl camp in northeast Syria. There are thousands of IS fighters who are being held there, kept there, along with their families. You would find many women in like full veil, burqa. There are many children as well. The situation is really tragic there. It's like, you know, a ticking bomb for radicalization. You know, children, if they see a woman without, you know, a headscarf on, they would shout on them that they are infidel, that they should be killed. It's just really a locked in place for radicalization in really dire conditions. And up until last week or the week before, all the responsibility of these, you know, camps and prisons was under the control of SDF fighters or the Syrian Democratic Forces, the Kurdish forces. But throughout the negotiations and the deal discussed with the government, the agreement was that they hand over the authority of controlling and monitoring these camps to the government, to the official government. But unfortunately, we've seen that in some cases the SDF abandoned the prisons, abandoned the camps. In one case, particularly, the doors were left wide open. And we've heard confirmed reports, at least, you know, dozens, if not more, of IS fighters fled these prisons trying to escape into Iraq. The Syrian government said that they've captured most of them, but we're not sure about the exact figures and numbers.

[00:02:48] Speaker 1: But there are foreign fighters or people from other countries who made their way to Syria and ended up in those camps.

[00:02:56] Speaker 2: Yeah, thousands of them. I mean, we've seen that during the IS times. We've seen people from the US, from the UK, you know, from France, from, you know, all across the international world where, you know, there was a hub for radicalization, and they joined forces of IS. And of course, there are still cases where their respective countries are still considering what to do with them. And this is where the role of the Syrian government comes, because this is what they've been saying over the past week about these prisons. Now, the US said that they're moving 7,000 fighters. They've already started to move them from Syria, from northeast Syria to Iraq. But the rest, the Syrian government said that they will be going through, you know, legal process. There will be trial. Those who are convicted will be prosecuted. But those who have nothing to be held for, they will be referred to rehabilitation center. Because after years of being in these camps, you've been fed with radical ideologies that is going to be a danger for the community and for the whole world.

[00:04:07] Speaker 1: I wonder if we can take a step back at this moment, because we've been talking about Kurdish forces, guarding IS suspects, and fighting the Syrian army, and now announcing a ceasefire deal. But how did we get to this point after that optimism, that point of optimism last year when the new government took power, when the Assad regime was overthrown?

[00:04:34] Speaker 2: Well, actually, if you look back at that moment, and if you look back, particularly at March 2025, the SDF forces led by their leader, Mazloum Abdi, was in Damascus, sat with President al-Sharia and signed an agreement, an agreement that will unify Syria and that will, you know, merge the Kurdish forces into the Syrian army and, you know, the Syrian public institutions. This is something that also the government gave, you know, a deadline for end of 2025 to be implemented. And throughout the whole year, we've been told by government sources that there were many meetings, many discussions and many negotiations going on with the Kurdish forces, with SDF, and they've rejected implementing this agreement.

[00:05:23] Speaker 1: Okay, so they signed a deal in March 2025, and then, but it didn't really ever get enacted. That's sort of what happened?

[00:05:32] Speaker 2: Absolutely. And this agreement came to be realized, supported by the US and the US being the main ally for the Kurdish. But the Kurdish forces did not get the message clear. They still wanted to keep their autonomous rule over northeast Syria. And mind you also that they don't only control Kurdish, majority Kurdish areas, but they also control Arab areas like Deir ez-Zor and Raqqa, that are the two big cities of oil reserve and have the highest source of income for the country. They've been controlling it. They've been controlling the income, they've been controlling the border crossing, they have their own airport. And this is something that the Syrian new government didn't want to agree for. They, the President al-Shara issued a decree last week granting the Kurds their rights for citizenship, their rights for nationality, for language, to be equal citizens with Syrians, something that the Assad rejected and deprived them of since the 1960s. They've been called as the unknown or unregistered, they had zero rights in Syria. And this is definitely not the way to go forward. So President al-Shara issued a decree to include them and to give them equal rights. However, their leadership refused to give up on oil, give up on autonomous rule and on, you know, controlling northeast Syria. But with pressure and mediation from mainly the US and many other partners, we've seen an agreement come to real effects today. And they've announced that they will be merging into the army and they have their own also divisions. They will have their own brigades within divisions in Kurdish controlled areas.

[00:07:24] Speaker 1: You mentioned the United States had been supporting the Kurds, had close ties with the Kurds for years. Some are arguing that the United States has now abandoned the Kurds by really supporting, placing support behind the new Syrian government. What do you make of that?

[00:07:43] Speaker 2: I think it depends on how you read the American position. The US supported SDF, Syrian Democratic Forces, over the past years, and they were partners in the fight against IS. Now there is a central government in Damascus. In the past, you know, there was a government that the US opposed and even sanctioned. But now this is a government that is opening new ties with the world, that is, you know, having great relationship with the US. They even lifted sanctions. They're supporting the leadership of President al-Shara. They lifted them from even the terrorism list. So they sent a clear message to SDF now, especially that, you know, President al-Shara signed an agreement with the US that Syria will join forces with the US in the fight against IS. So the role now should go to the government in this mandate. The US did not abandon the Kurds, but basically told the Kurds your role now is to be part of Syria, part of the Syrian government, part of a united Syria. The most important issue is that for this government to prove that it is capable of representing a multi-ethnic, multi-religious and diverse country to protect the minority groups' rights, including the Kurds, and have a Syria that represents the whole society, something that is still at stake in Syria.

[00:09:12] Speaker 1: Thanks, Lina. If you liked this episode, please subscribe to us here on YouTube. And if you'd like us to cover any other stories, leave a comment below. You can hear more international news on the BBC's Global News Podcast. Listen wherever you get your podcasts. Bye-bye.