Speaker 1: You know, if you think about GRC and just from your perspective, it means a lot of things to different people, and sometimes many, many things to the same person. So if you think about just the broad scope of what GRC is, how would you define it or how would you put a boundary or kind of put a lasso around what the whole thing is?

Speaker 2: Yeah, I think GRC is really a very hard thing to define. I try to define it as we get sort of new employees in and folks that come into our organization that aren't sort of traditionally part of this industry, trying to explain it to them really takes a little time to try to sort of define the full scope of it. At the very top, I generally sort of start with the notion that, in essence, GRC is how to best run a business or how to best run an organization. It really includes all facets, you know, from the ground up of how you think about the values of your company, how you think about delivering those values, both within and external to your company, as well as all of the sort of functional type things that go around the organization to help address risk and compliance in the organization. I think it's not a specific department aspect, but it really is a concept that drives across the organization, across the enterprise, and really across the extended enterprise as well.

Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, I mean, obviously, when we talk about GRC, I actually like that description. We always think about, you know, if the organization's driving toward objectives and focused on driving toward objectives, this new world of GRC really encompasses all of those functions, those activities that kind of keep the company on the rails as they're driving toward all of those objectives. And you're right, it's, you know, it's not a department. It's not a single department, and that's one thing that comes, it seems to come up time and time again, you know, and it's sort of the number one, I guess, misconception is, well, do I have a GRC department? And I think the answer, almost always, is no. I guess it's, you and I could probably drum up an example where it would make sense to consolidate into a single department a lot of these activities, but very rarely is that the case. And that's the challenge. Therefore, the challenge is, you know, because it's not in one department, so much of it is about indirect influence, you know, kind of monitoring from a distance as opposed to direct control over things, you know.

Speaker 2: Well, and, you know, I think traditionally, when we think about the fact that, you know, it's been, people think about it being owned by, you know, one single department, you know, they think about compliance, and they think about, oh, we have a compliance department, or they think about risk management, and they say, oh, we've got risk managers over here, you know, sort of, you know, dealing with those aspects, but really, it's a team effort. It really drives across the functions. You need all the other functions, you know, including, you know, folks in marketing, including folks in the operations, to really help carry out those initiatives and to protect the organization. I mean, it's part of everybody's job to think about compliance and risk and how to drive, you know, sort of the ethical values that the company wants to drive.

Speaker 1: Right.