Speaker 1: Kelly is with us from Kalamazoo, Michigan. Hi Kelly, how are you? I'm better than I

Speaker 2: deserve. How are you Dave? Just the same. What's up? I have a question. We have a brand new college student and my question is around how to help him budget to help him feel responsible for his college education with the money that he's earning knowing that he can't pay for it all. Okay, I'm a little bit

Speaker 1: confused. The money that he's earning? He's developed a good work ethic and

Speaker 2: we've always followed the principle that when the kids make any money or they get their commission that 70% spend and then 20 and a 10% go into save and share and he doesn't he doesn't make enough money to pay for his college education. We have the money to do that but we don't want to just freely write checks and so I'm wondering why not? We want him to be invested in his education.

Speaker 1: Okay, does that require money? Why can he not be emotionally invested in his education? Because it sounds like this is a good kid. It doesn't sound like you got

Speaker 2: a troubled kid here. Well, he is a good kid and I'll tell you what was disappointing to us is that he worked hard all summer and we should have been watching more closely but it really looks like he spent most of what he was making on coffee and fast food and he wasn't putting much money in his

Speaker 1: savings account. Did you have the expectation that he was

Speaker 2: going to pay for fall? We had an expectation that he was going to contribute and maybe that's where we made the mistake. Yeah, it is on you then

Speaker 1: because you didn't manage a senior in high school's thing here where you said okay you need this much money and that means you need to be putting aside this much a week and I'm gonna look and verify that you are doing that. Okay. Because he did what every high school senior would do, coffee and fast food. Okay. So you know if you have an expectation that he, now your reason for him paying for it is just that you want him invested though, not because you need him to do that financially. We really don't. Okay. The reason I'm asking is there's a spectrum on paying for college, okay, all the way to I know one guy who's wealthy and he won't pay a dime of his kids college. He said they're gonna figure it out. They can go get loans. They can they can work. They can do whatever but I'm not paying for it and I've told him that since they were three, get over it. He's really wealthy. He can do it. He just that's one end of the spectrum. The other end of the spectrum is the end that that we were on and that was we saved up and had the money and we paid cash for their college and gave them a monthly stipend to exist on. That was not a lot but it was a reasonable amount. The kids always claimed it was about half of what they needed so they had to work some to get some spending money but but they were invested just not financially invested in college. They had proven their ability to save and give with buying their first car, that kind of stuff. We taught that lesson there. We did not teach it at college and yet every one of them, because we work together to manage schedules and expectations and so forth, you're gonna behave in a way that's consistent with our value system or we're not paying for it and that includes getting good grades and that includes being on a four-year schedule because after four years I'm paying for nothing and all three graduated in four years and all three graduated with reasonably good grades. One of them magna cum or something or other but you know so you know that's the other end from my buddy who makes them pay for everything. You're kind of in the middle between those two ends, right? In the way you're going at it and so none of the three are wrong, it's just you've got to clearly communicate what's going on there and ask yourself why are you doing that? In my buddy's case, you know, he argues with me all the time that I spoiled my kids and my kids performance in the marketplace indicates anything except spoiled. They're all three very hard-working and very diligent and so apparently I didn't spoil them but he says well they would have they would have been a lot tougher, they would have been a lot better off if you'd have made them work their way through. Yeah, maybe. That's probably true. I worked my way through so it doesn't kill you. You know

Speaker 2: my husband and I both put ourselves through college and we're both really proud of that so I think that especially for my husband it's hard to think about just paying for a kid to go to college and just writing the checks without him

Speaker 1: contributing. If they have a mentality, an entitlement mentality or if they're not performing and they're not living their life according to our value system, boom, I'm right there. Instantaneously I'm right there but I think, in other words, I feel like my kids in defense of this position, not to argue, but there's two ways of looking at it and I think both are right. Either one's okay with me but in defense I think the kids obviously were emotionally and spiritually invested in the process because they performed. If they had not been invested in the process they would not have gotten out in four years with good grades and lived, you know, not perfect but a clean life. I got you. And so that's what you're looking for. So as far as if you want them to invest, you need to tell them how much and when and help them develop some reasonable goals and expectations. Don't just let them wander along and then can't figure out why high school seniors spend all his money on fast food. That's on you guys. But next semester if you want him to work and he needs to have $300 to put in or $500 or $2,000 or whatever number you come up with, communicate that and indicate that and show them how to get enough hours and, you know, help them set the goals and develop realistic ways of reaching those goals and then you're right. By God they'll be invested. And I don't have a problem with that, by the way. Let me say one more time. I don't think your husband is wrong. I don't think that at all. But I also don't think we're wrong on the other side. So I think it's just a different approach to the same subject. What I do think is wrong is to just, you know, write checks for kids who are misbehaving or kids who won't go to class or kids who have an entitlement bratty mentality or stuff like that. I'm not, I'm not gonna suggest you put money behind that kind of thing. But neither you nor I were facing that in our situations. So, hey, great question. Thanks for joining us.